deleted by creator

I agree with the overall sentiment that a significant portion of the population needing to understand theory for a revolution is completely false (that’s what the vanguard is for!) but it’s gonna be a long while (like probably at least a century or so) for Americans material conditions to be anywhere near poor enough for them to want to risk their lives

You’re completely correct. And the Bolsheviks also faced the issue of being outright atheistic in a country where the vast majority were fairly devout peasants for many of whom the Tsar was still a religious figure and who couldn’t really imagine what developed capitalism, let alone socialism, would mean. It’s also important to note that this was not an exclusively rural issue, as the majority of urban workers and soldiers had come fairly recently from peasant contexts.

In other words they had their work cut out for them in many ways that contemporary communists in the Imperial core do not. On the other hand, Russia in 1917 was not a society in which the core values necessary for the functioning of a capitalist society had fully imbued everyday culture and life in the way they had already done in Western countries and as is the case in the contemporary world, which is more capitalistic than any point prior to the 1980s (though I would argue that this peaked in the late 90s/early 2000s). The transformation of politics into another identitarian symbol and virtue-signalling component of western ultras’ personal aesthetics is a reflection of this conception of politics as a part of personal identity, of the construction and selling of oneself as a purely aesthetic product. For many leftists in the west their leftism amounts mainly to a form of lifestyle aesthetics, and often as a kind of surrogate or substitute form feelings of communal belonging and spiritual, religious or historical meaning and significance. Now I’m not saying the latter are unimportant or necessarily bad in every respect, but it does seem to be the extent of the political participation of most people self-identifying as socialist in the west. Capitalism obviously sells us the opiates to lessen the anguish of the sense of nihilism it also naturally produces, and it has become less and less shy or reluctant to do so by repackaging leftist, socialist or communist symbols. This has a broader, more indirect effect on culture, which doesn’t reduce to, say, a capitalist firm selling Che Guevara t-shirts. A great example from American popular culture is Hip Hop. Contemporary mainstream rap, especially trap, in many ways reflect how the political radicalism of 70s black politics was transmuted into the popularized black petit bourgeois entrepreneurialism of the 1980s, and which you see in contemporary rap music everywhere, only where the American dream ideology takes the classic form of socio-economic ascent from the lumpenproletariat as opposed to the traditional working class. Political radicalism is far less at the forefront of Hip Hop than it was in the 80s.

The key thing that the West is lacking is not dislike for the conditions of capitalism. Your average worker also does not think that the conditions capitalism forces them to live in are acceptable. The issue is that they do not think of these as the natural or inevitable conditions of capitalism. Most people cannot define capitalism, let alone correctly. One of the issues for contemporary communists definitely seems to me to be that of how to make clear sense of the fact that while the conditions of capitalist life in the West are worsening for the majority, there has not been more impulse towards the construction of vanguard parties. Definitely relevant is the general cultural factor mentioned above, as well as a truly industrial propaganda-media complex that leverages the ‘failures’ (real and imagined) of previous attempts at socialism and plays without shame on ideas of nationalism (including liberal ones of very limited modern progress on social issues in the US) in order leave little room for people to feel comfortable expressing openly communist ideas. Poor education is also an issue.

deleted by creator

Young people of every generation are statistically more open-minded than their older counterparts. It doesn’t necessarily indicate a generational shift until it can be demonstrated that the ideology persists in traditionally pro-capitalist age groups.

Was it not the boomers who were the edgy anti-capitalist hippies during the 60s and 70s?

I’m not holding my breath; I fully expect millennials and gen Z to go full grillpill when they have more stake in the status quo (401k, house, kids, career goals, etc).

I hope I’m wrong. But we should oppose simple optimism. Optimism doesn’t change the world, it encourages an attitude of helplessness and complacency at times when direct action is necessary.

deleted by creator

Whenever I see similar polls it makes me consider the average American doesn’t see the terms capitalism and socialism like we do. The average person sees these as character traits, not movements or distinct economic structures. Capitalist simply means greedy businessman, nothing structural. Socialism is high taxes and government doing stuff.

I would very much agree with your assessment. I think the public discourse has failed to get the idea of structural thought into these words. It’s really sad to me that while most people would totally be onboard with socialism and communism but lack the language to even understand what they actually are. I always feel like you have describe Socialism in these very obtuse ways to obfuscate what it’s called to get average Americans onboard. As soon as you call it what it is, they bug out.

I wonder how many of the revolutionary proletarians during the rise of communism knew their shit. Not many I guess, but they had people they followed that did, like Lenin, even if they didn’t completely understand the theory or fully agreed with it.

Then again people back then didn’t have a century of propaganda to deal with…

If it was not for hexbear, I don’t think i wouod have ever heard of him

I love talking politics with people and I have talked to A LOT of libs. Most agree that we need to tax the corporations more, the capitalists have gotten too greedy, we should spend more of the defense budget on healthcare, infrastructure etc.

Not a single one of them thinks that revolution should be anywhere on the table. And when some of them finally admit that China is doing something good, it’s only because China is not socialist, it is a capitalist country! That’s why it is able to raise the living standards of its people because they have adopted some of our capitalist policies! But unlike us, they’re totalitarians!

deleted by creator

“Actually existing socialism,” countries where socialism is the dominant mode of production, such as Cuba.

Actual existing socialism, usually a reference for states that were or are ran by a communist party that was or is attempting to build towards a socialist society with historical and material proof of that.

Actually Existing Socialism

So, if democracy is bad…then why not adopt technocracy and not let those rubes anywhere near a position of power?

The American Medical Association, after extensive research, has found that me being trans is not a sign there’s anything wrong with me. Who cares if 99% of this shithole wants me dead? Experts say I’m fine and that’s all that matters. Not my fault most people are unthinking morons.

I’m sure to some extent this is also survivorship bias but having lived in homes and apartments both 10-30 years old and 80-100+ years old, the old ones have all been way better.

Thanks.

‘All do whatever and no one tell us what to do,’ there is a lot more to anarchism than that though. You can work on a better government currently while still striving for the ultimate removal of the state.

No offense, but have you been talking to people? My friends who think they’re socialists think this means paying more taxes for public infrastructure, or taxing the corporations more to pay for it.

At the same time, they hate communism, which they think is trying to give people free stuff without having to work and make everyone receive the same salary. I have a friend, self-proclaimed socialist, thinks Andrew Yang is a communist because he wants to give people universal basic income.

These are the “socialists” you’re dealing with.

But they dont want none of that tankie crap right

Yeah I’d like to know how many of those people can define socialism and which historical societies they consider to be genuine attempts at socialist-construction.