All AES have freedom of religion with party officials acting as regulators to ensure imperialism does not enter through religion.
Read the Chinese Community Party Central Committee’s The Basic Viewpoint and Policy on the Religious Question during Our Country’s Socialist Period from 1982 (also called Document 19). In addition to banning feudal religious rights and foreign missions agencies, they also admit that making religion illegal does more harm than good and make plans for the future by creating regulatory bodies for each major religion. In doing so, they are allowing people to be religious within the confines of a communist society rather than capitalist imperialism. They also predict a consistent decrease in religiosity but, in the 40 years since it’s publication, religiosity has continued to increase in China.
DPRK has a Buddhist Federation and Christian Federation to supervise all activities. They seem a bit laxer than CPC, perhaps due to Kim Il Sung’s Christian upbringing.
The policies of banning cults has been successful in China, Falun Gong and the Moonies being the most popular ones stamped out.
The building of communism is the priority. Religion serves to bolster that and gives a connection to non-communist communities as a way to continue to build an internationalist vision of communism.
If China and North Korea understand this, have had massive success in doing so (nevermind Cuba among others) and are succeeding in building communism in spite of fucking everything this world throws at them, I’d say it’s a good example to follow.
Xi has increased regulation recently to combat this, but yeah, it’s still a problem. Vatican still cries about not having any say over the Chinese Catholics which is very funny to me
Yes. I’m very aware. I’m guessing you haven’t seen other points where I’m fine with great degree of freedom of religion, indeed more than the vast majority of people on this site. You seem to be missing my point, which is that ML having to compromise through relations with Islamist theocratic states is a shame, in particular as the particular form of Shia Islam promoted by Iran is particularly nefarious, it being Islamist.
Global south liberation is more important than handwringing about specifics like this. When hands are finally off a region, they’ll be allowed to develop in their own way, and then the basis for a revolution will be even more possible. AES forming an anti-Occidental bloc to combat is more important for our vision than insisting that these societies must now immediately conform to our ideas. Not to say queer lib, women’s lib, worker lib, etc is not important; but instead that by working against these countries we delay those things even more.
OP’s comment made no implication of being against Islamism “more” than western imperialism. They’re just expressing disappointment in the relationship because even if it’s necessary for North Korea to survive, it still violates basic principles of international socialism and their own history.
Am I not allowed to be upset with Vietnam for having close ties to Israel and the US even though it needs to develop as a nation? What about China’s history of suppressing communists to spite the USSR (and now to form relations with the Philippines)? You don’t need to hold back views of the status quo just because there are greater threats out there, especially on an irrelevant forum where posts mean little.
In real life, I have to bite my own tongue over Hamas because the enemy doesn’t give a shit about nuance when you’re protesting and shutting things down. But on a website where nothing is happening, it doesn’t hurt to express disappointment that communists must compromise so much just to not be exterminated. My jokes about Hamas are more black and white because it serves to piss Zionists off, but when talking with other communists, well, I don’t fucking like them.
AES forming an anti-Occidental bloc to combat is more important for our vision than insisting that these societies must now immediately conform to our ideas.
Yes, of course. I like to compare it to the weird ideology of unions saving the world. If BRICS gets what it wants and the countries get more power and influence - great. Awesome. But look at the Americans - why would people give up their small, propagandized “luxuries” if every force and institution is pushing for the status quo, or even a mythical “before time” when everything was somehow greater? China already said it doesn’t export revolution, and I highly doubt that’s some 5D chess by Xi to hide his power levels until production forces are built. What little pro-revolution support China had for the third world during the 20th century is long gone. It’s the era of realpolitik, and everyone’s compromising. You can have hope all you want, but I prefer to look at what’s happening now and be disappointed in reality.
okay
good so we’re on the same page that at best it’s commendable political pragmatism.
All AES have freedom of religion with party officials acting as regulators to ensure imperialism does not enter through religion.
If China and North Korea understand this, have had massive success in doing so (nevermind Cuba among others) and are succeeding in building communism in spite of fucking everything this world throws at them, I’d say it’s a good example to follow.
lol this has lapsed
Xi has increased regulation recently to combat this, but yeah, it’s still a problem. Vatican still cries about not having any say over the Chinese Catholics which is very funny to me
Yes. I’m very aware. I’m guessing you haven’t seen other points where I’m fine with great degree of freedom of religion, indeed more than the vast majority of people on this site. You seem to be missing my point, which is that ML having to compromise through relations with Islamist theocratic states is a shame, in particular as the particular form of Shia Islam promoted by Iran is particularly nefarious, it being Islamist.
Global south liberation is more important than handwringing about specifics like this. When hands are finally off a region, they’ll be allowed to develop in their own way, and then the basis for a revolution will be even more possible. AES forming an anti-Occidental bloc to combat
is more important for our vision than insisting that these societies must now immediately conform to our ideas. Not to say queer lib, women’s lib, worker lib, etc is not important; but instead that by working against these countries we delay those things even more.
Opposing Islamism more than Euro Dominance just makes you a nerd like Christopher Hitchens.
OP’s comment made no implication of being against Islamism “more” than western imperialism. They’re just expressing disappointment in the relationship because even if it’s necessary for North Korea to survive, it still violates basic principles of international socialism and their own history.
Am I not allowed to be upset with Vietnam for having close ties to Israel and the US even though it needs to develop as a nation? What about China’s history of suppressing communists to spite the USSR (and now to form relations with the Philippines)? You don’t need to hold back views of the status quo just because there are greater threats out there, especially on an irrelevant forum where posts mean little.
In real life, I have to bite my own tongue over Hamas because the enemy doesn’t give a shit about nuance when you’re protesting and shutting things down. But on a website where nothing is happening, it doesn’t hurt to express disappointment that communists must compromise so much just to not be exterminated. My jokes about Hamas are more black and white because it serves to piss Zionists off, but when talking with other communists, well, I don’t fucking like them.
Yes, of course. I like to compare it to the weird ideology of unions saving the world. If BRICS gets what it wants and the countries get more power and influence - great. Awesome. But look at the Americans - why would people give up their small, propagandized “luxuries” if every force and institution is pushing for the status quo, or even a mythical “before time” when everything was somehow greater? China already said it doesn’t export revolution, and I highly doubt that’s some 5D chess by Xi to hide his power levels until production forces are built. What little pro-revolution support China had for the third world during the 20th century is long gone. It’s the era of realpolitik, and everyone’s compromising. You can have hope all you want, but I prefer to look at what’s happening now and be disappointed in reality.