Amidst California’s ongoing efforts to promote environmentally friendly transportation and the changing landscape of hydrogen fuel infrastructure, Toyota has announced a dramatic rebate of up to $40,000 off MSRP for the 2023 Toyota Mirai.

  • I_like_turtles3@lemmy.world
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    9 months ago

    can be powered by hydrogen.

    Here is the lie, because this implies more carbon released in the atmosphere. It’s not free. Anything that can power the “infrastructure” can be directly supplied to cars, via copper cables. You will always have this issue, you cannot hide from it. ANY source of energy you can imagine can be used to power EVs instead of your hydrogen thing. You cannot escape this, there’s no way around it. You are lying, shamelessly for that matter.

    • Hypx@kbin.socialOP
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      9 months ago

      Again, wrong. More gibberish. Green hydrogen can power any aspect of transportation. You do not need to have to involve carbon. Pipelines exist too. You can replace copper wires with pipelines, and it would be cheaper to move energy this way.

      Again, the problem is that you need giant banks of batteries to power your all-BEV fantasy. That is much more expensive and in fact implies an unbreakable dependence on fossil fuels to build those things. Something avoided with hydrogen.

      In fact, you have fully inverted reality. Hydrogen, not batteries, are mandatory in a renewable energy powered society. You will have to accept this simply fact.

      Finally, you have to let go of BEV propaganda. It is all lies copied over from the oil & gas industry. It is all lies with zero basis in fact.

      • I_like_turtles3@lemmy.world
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        9 months ago

        Green hydrogen can power any aspect of transportation. You do not need to have to involve carbon

        Stop lying. You automatically have more carbon in the air by using Hydrogen for the same amount of “mined” energy. You will use more energy in the end using Hydrogen. You cannot have a reliable source of Hydrogen energy for the car sector, as compared to electrical current. You are not receiving that Hydrogen from the Sun, for free. It will cost more and pollute more. Hydrogen is the petrol industry in disguise. You want to pollute more, liars.

        • Hypx@kbin.socialOP
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          9 months ago

          Green hydrogen is made by electrolysis of water using wind and solar energy. There is no carbon involved. As green energy scales up, the cost of this will drop to extremely low levels. Margin cost is basically zero, as you only need water.

          As a result, it is a far simpler and scalable solution than going with batteries. You avoid all of the mining and infrastructure of batteries. And because it is so much more scalable, you end up having to use hydrogen for energy storage anyways. Even BEVs will have to depend on hydrogen power for long-duration energy storage needs.

          The problem is, again, you are fully brainwashed. You are repeating nothing but BEV propaganda from companies like Tesla. And the ironic thing is that this all originated from oil & gas companies. It is climate change denial rhetoric only you don’t know it.

          • I_like_turtles3@lemmy.world
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            9 months ago

            Green hydrogen is made by electrolysis of water using wind and solar energy.

            YES! So why not use that electrical energy you use for electrolysis, to power the car? Electrolysis has losses, then another set of losses when converting back to electric at car motor. I cannot believe this bullshit, how the hell can you lie with no shame? There’s no way you can avoid these losses, this is basic level of understanding you do not need a EE degree for it. You cannot avoid losses, and they are forever ingrained in the nature of our reality. The only thing you can do is continue to try and misrepresent the situation, and lying. You are literally hand waving the losses, it’s surreal.

            • Hypx@kbin.socialOP
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              9 months ago

              Because, again, you need to store that energy in banks of giant batteries. Something that is very expensive. And again, if you realize that FCEVs are basically doing to same thing, just using water instead of giant batteries, it is going to much cheaper while not actually reducing efficiency that much.

              In the long-run, there won’t be hardly ANY difference in efficiency, because again, both are electrochemical systems that work the same way. This is the basic fact that you are failing to grasp.

              Finally, hydrogen is pretty unavoidable for a green society anyways. You need it for long-duration energy storage anyways, and so will industry and heavy transportation. Meaning that even an all-BEV society will still need vast amounts of green hydrogen if it really wants to break dependency on fossil fuels.

              If anything, you are handwaving the problems of BEVs. Hydrogen is the solution to that ironically.

              • I_like_turtles3@lemmy.world
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                9 months ago

                Stop lying and shilling something you don’t even understand so others get more money and destroy the planet. Stop contributing to this shit cause dude, you are literally willing to make everything worse just so you get paid. There’s no way a reasonable human which understands what is happening is siding with hydrogen. Also you’re simply hand waving away serious issues about the whole thing

                don’t worry about it

                it will be fine relax

                Nah, that’s not how this works dude.

                • Hypx@kbin.socialOP
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                  9 months ago

                  Again, you are the one brainwashed by corporate propaganda, mainly from Tesla. An FCEV is an EV. That is undeniable fact. As a result, it is equally as valid of a solution as BEVs are. The rest of your posts are you being totally confused by this fact.