In many ways they already are ahead. The front end is a bit wonky though, and some of the foundational features are still catching up (it’s fully functioning though).

For one thing, they have “categories” of communities, and for another I can block all users from any instance I choose - though there is really no easy way to accomplish that while still on Lemmy proper.

But like when you upvote something, later it remembers that but won’t show you the color. The interface is really pretty though, and solves several of the issues I had with Lemmy, like another one is that you can turn on viewing or both the upvote and separate downvote counts, which for Lemmy iirc you can only see that for comments, but for posts that only shows on the mobile site yet not on the desktop for some reason.

The PieFed devs are super responsive, quite extraordinary so imho. It’s like they care or something (uh… cause they do, ofc!:-).

So especially since Lemmy is not perfect either, check out both Mbin and PieFed and just see them in action without an account, just for the fun of it.:-)

That’s kneet.:-)

He sufferes for our transgressions:-).

I found this video to be quite positive. It’s titled "Why I’m not worried about the election, so ofc I expected some BS but I’ve liked him in the past and sure enough, he came up with some surprisingly good thoughts.

And if it helps, here is a reply:-)

No (I think?) - I thought your link showed that Lemmy was showing inaccurate information as well. So what I was proposing was perhaps better than what Lemmy does, in the sense that Lemmy would pull in the additional posts upon a new voting occurrence, but PieFed could block that and either show only posts for which fully accurate information is available, and then discard those where the extra (voting) information is not available, or else it could go a step further and go ahead and show those posts that only have partial information but make sure to label it specially to indicate that. Lemmy does neither of those.

Second issue: right - an admin should be able to, and maybe there’s no real reason to prevent regular users either, but it shouldn’t be so common, so it would be nice to move the link to do that somewhere else so that new users (like me!) don’t get confused about what it means and is supposed to do and pull things in on a whim without knowing the factors involved.

Unless… maybe… he WASN’T???😅

Yeah some amount of that is inevitable, but see e.g. https://hexbear.net/post/3820065 for an example of the type of content that you are “missing”, being on lemmy.world that has defederated from hexbear. Also note how it’s not just the post itself but how supportive of the position the comments are (overall), with several of them expressing an explicit desire to do such again, and the overall theme being how “funny” it was.

Now mind you, there is still a lot of similar content that you aren’t “missing”, from places such as lemmy.ml, but hexbear.net is most definitely a special place full of toxic trolls (many of whom continue to troll us after the defederation via their lemmy.ml alts, bc consent means little to them). Here is another example, this time from lemmy.ml that almost no instances have defederated from, since the admins are also the developers of the sourcecode for Lemmy: https://lemmy.ml/post/22043103. The cognitive dissonance is in full display on that instance by declaring that what the Western nations do is “genocide” (I mean…), yet somehow what Russia and China are doing is not genocide - either directly (Uyghurs & Ukraine) or indirectly (the USA has sent support to Israel, while Russia has also sent support to the other side of that conflict). Realistically, both the USA and Russia are supporting genocide, but NOT EQUALLY SO, as one of those two nations is also actively engaging in that activity directly.

Because of so very many posts from this, and toxic trolling from many of their users, I have gone to great lengths to find a way to block both hexbear.net and lemmy.ml, even switching instances to piefed.social that allows a normal user, without needing admin support, to block all users from any instance of my choice (https://piefed.social/post/307636 ). There are also some apps that can do that as well, though you won’t find that option provided in basic Lemmy. I’m not necessarily advocating for such a switch, but it’s nice to know that it’s possible, and it is good to be aware of what content is out there and in particular note where it comes from - i.e. you may want to block at the very least communities such as !memes@lemmy.ml, if you don’t enjoy having the above-mentioned content finding its way into your feed.:-)

Damn I loved that Star Trek episode - it was so great! It’s so easy to just keep doing the same old thing - e.g. to explore the stars, but to join a card game - THAT would be a NEW adventure, surely.

But as for the possible, one idea would be to make a hard separation: let’s say a PieFed user joins a new community XYZ. As of that very moment, all newly made posts along with all votes come in, and everything that can make it there through any federation networking issues are reflected in that posts, BUT all old posts do not show up - even if new votes or comments are sent, those are simply discarded - and perhaps a message is displayed “there are no more posts available from this community”. So everything NEW is fully there (to the extent possible/feasible), while everything OLD is fully missing (it would have been only partial/misleading information anyway), and this way there is nothing in-between.

At least, it’s a thought:-). Surely it would not please everyone, but it might be a least worst option?

On top of that though, the world is literally different today than it was then. Some things changed EVERYTHING - agriculture, fire, medicine, even just knowing to wash our hands, etc. The advent of vaccines may have arguably altered our world in beautiful, wonderful, and potentially terrible ways - allowing children to have an extremely high chance to reach 80 years of age, as opposed to an enormous chance (way more than half) of dying prior to 5 years old.

And the information era radically altered our world. Except it also birthed the post-information, or perhaps we should call it the disinformation era. When companies such as Google were playing nice, we had free access to ALL of the information in the entire world. Whereas now… we don’t, but as soon as they can figure it out, they’ll have us sign up with a subscription to be able to “know things”. What came before was always temporary, but we lied to ourselves telling one another or at least acting as if it would last forever.

My proof: https://hexbear.net/post/3820065. I know it’s hexbear, but click it anyway. Hint: it’s dis-information - active retelling of the story so as to ignore the facts and substitute their own presentation of their own… “alternative facts”.

And for someone who isn’t smart enough to know the difference, how can they tell the difference? WE heard the horrific screams of the police officer as they were brutally murdered. We know of the other ones who died, including one who later committed suicide. We have empathy for their families. We saw the hearings. We heard the testimony, of the officers. We have seen the people involved admit their actions, and some apologized.

Or, you know, iT wAs PEacEfUlL, “it was hilarious and looked like tailgating gone wrong after too much booze”, or as one commenter said “I hope it happens again” (11 upvotes as of now).

So… WILL we learn the lessons that we would need to in order to survive? I am not so certain myself. But maybe! Either way, we indeed will HAVE to, if there is to be any hope of the survival of our current way of life IMHO.

Part 2 of 2.

That said: I thought that we have a problem that Lemmy does not: we allow users to pull in older posts. But your linked example seems to disprove that - do you know how they got those posts then, even though they are “old”? Or perhaps I am misunderstanding something: we CAN get older posts, but we usually choose NOT to, UNLESS someone specifically requests the pulling in of such a post. Damn it does get complicated:-). In general though, I hope you see what I meant to convey: if we can only get new posts and cannot get old ones accurately, then perhaps it is better not to try to get those old ones (except as ghosts/shortcut links)?

As for existing backfilled posts - yeah, it is unfortunate, but it is what it is and I don’t think “backwards compatability” to existing entries is our primary concern right now? If it were, they could perhaps be deleted - if we could even figure out which ones they are? - or left alone. A year from now they will confuse the heck out of people… but that can be an adventure for them to puzzle over, so long as things work properly from here forward - do you agree? :-D

Anyway it’s just something fun to think about:-).

Part 1 of 2.

In the past I have used the rainbow-colored Fediverse icon for things like a quick short-cut to the original instance, to check things like the community or instance rules, but mostly ever since Lemmy started being able to read the static.wikia types of images, I haven’t needed it anymore, now that all instances display more or less identical content for a given post.

With the exception of that known Lemmy.World federation issue. What happened there, from what I hear, is that the Fediverse was never meant to have a singular server holding 80% of the entire userbase, and to have every community be joined by someone on every instance (which Blaze has been doing with his army of alts, to aid newcomers who couldn’t figure out how to join a community that nobody else on the instance had already joined yet). Read more here: https://aussie.zone/post/13429731 (github issue linked from there). TLDR: the issue is already solved (probably) but is in the 0.19.6 version, which Lemmy.ml is testing but until Lemmy.World upgrades to it this issue will continue. I’ve seen it happen on piefed.social, but also startrek.website, discuss.online, and other servers as well.

But in general, I was not asking to be able to view every single post from its original server (though again, that would be somewhat useful, occasionally), nor even being able to pull in a post when it is not there, but to make the pulling in of a post be either full or else none. Here is a simple mathematical equation that may perhaps help: 1 + 1 = 2 is true, and 1 + 1 = ? could also be true, but 1 + 1 = 1 is not. The first one is fully and precisely true, the second is vague and unsatisfying that someone doesn’t know the answer… but at least it is still technically correct. Whereas the third answer is just flat false.

It sounds like from what you and others are saying that it is literally impossible to be able to get the answer of “2” via the current methods of Federation. Okay then, well that seems to inform our answer: if we absolutely cannot get the proper answer of “2”, then we should put “?”, but in no case should we (imho at least) show “1”, just b/c after we pull in a post it receives +1 upvote. “x+1=1” is invalid for nearly all values of x, except the one that happens to be true, and yet ALL of the others are false, hence we should not shorten x+1 to merely say “1” as if 1 + 1 = 1 were a correct statement.

Alternatively, which depending on interrelation with other reasons might be the better way even, perhaps we should simply disallow the pulling in of posts altogether - if they cannot be done “properly” then perhaps to avoid misleading aka false statements, it should not be done at all?

Still further alternatives could be to (1) pull in “ghost” or “shortcut” versions of the post, which are displayed VERY noticably different than “real” ones, and which when clicked go to the original server, and which also have something like “?” or “n/a” rather than a vote count; or (2) similar to 1 but which when clicked show all of the comments, those having been pulled in via some other means (API?) but there too the vote count(s?) should not be displayed, unless they are known to be accurate.

Other matters also interrelate with the above though. e.g. I notice that piefed.social has defederated from hexbear.net (https://piefed.social/instance/hexbear.net does not resolve and https://piefed.social/instances?search=hex&submit=Search looks empty) - so if any votes can from that instance, those should not be counted. Web scraping would include them though, and others e.g. those from people who piefed.social (or any PieFed instance, just picking on that one:-) has banned. Perhaps this is a minor point, but it does touch on how those vote counts are interrelated to other matters, which if brought in via “alternative” means will make it harder to figure out what to display for them. And… oops, I see that you already got to the reverse of that point, where Beehaw would add vote counts, beyond what e.g. web scraping would be able to pick up. Well, nothing is fully perfect, but I did want to suggest that we avoid any KNOWN sources of misinformation. Some corner cases like that… can be saved for perhaps another day when further developing this ActivityPub implementation makes more sense, compared to other more urgent things that need to be worked on in the meantime. i.e., especially if something is also a problem for Lemmy, then it seems understandable to me that if it is likewise a problem for PieFed, then there is little “expectation” that we would do better than them, in every single possible way?

Damn, I’ve hit a space limit.

Oh I see - I was making assumptions about what you said and I apologize for that. You aren’t saying “eVerY tHiNG iS goInG to BE FiNe”, but rather, the USA could end, and yet… humanity will go on. (that might still be debatable as well…)

Yes, your thoughts exactly mirror my own: the only way is to move forward, and what will be will be - hopefully we can minimize the pain, and things WILL change regardless, and yet we still go on, having learned all the more from the doing.

1. bold of you to presume that American democracy will last that long

2. the kids have their own issues, including not knowing or being able to do much of anything, which is not entirely all or even mostly their own fault

We have more people than are necessary anyway. With the combined effects of both globalization and automation, more and more jobs - even middle-class ones such as (low-level) “lawyer” and “manager” - are becoming superfluous.

So I think at this point that the wealthy wouldn’t mind, and based on what e.g. JD Vance is currently saying even outright prefer, to have the mother stay home and take care of the children. While in turn they pay the man lower wages, and possibly also pay in “company scrip”, where both healthcare and potentially even housing (and perhaps starting to add in things like food) could all be tied to the job.

And I am not sure that they care what the children actually learn. Although “they” control e.g. FaceBook, X, Threads, etc., and books that are less trackable are already starting to be literally and physically and actually burned, so they already control what they learn.

And in a couple of months, the USA could switch sides and outright join Russian aggression - or at least significantly scale back the current level of opposition - at which point the Ukranians too, plus ofc Taiwan, maybe Japan, and anyone else that China sets their sights on. Plus with the USA backing those Axis powers, the sky’s the limit really.

Meanwhile companies like FaceBook or Reddit don’t really seem to care, only chasing profits, and Twitter has flat-out joined the fight on the other side, by cancelling itself into becoming X.

These are dangerous tools that we are playing with - far more so than guns - b/c knowledge is power, after all.

Yes:-). Though if it is an isolated occurrence then it may not reflect the experience with the instance overall? Then again, if the software is being auto-updated, new problems seem like they would crop up constantly. I definitely doubt that “normies” are going to want to join an experimental server - they want safe and stable.

Which at this point, seems basically to be: Mbin (except I don’t like that UI), PieFed (the UI is better though not perfect), or being constrained to use one of only a handful of Apps that provide that functionality. All of those involve gaining a greater degree of independence from the Lemmy sourcecode, since it will not provide this functionality by itself.