Disco Elysium's studio ZA/UM terminates the game's successor and fires a third of its staff. Wages a war against its own artists. Chaos ensues. Kurvitz is vi...
but saying that Robert Kurvitz was solely responsible for the game is unfair to the dozens of people who also poured their hearts and souls into the game
Sure, and many people forget Helen Hindpere (second lead writer) and Aleksandr Rostov (art director) also left with Kurvitz. And even then, despite Rostov being responsible for the overall visual style the Thought Cabinet was painted by Anton Vill, and I don’t know for sure who made the portraits/skill depictions but it might also have been him (though they are more in the style of Rostov - see the 3 archetype paintings which were created by Rostov).
Look, I know it was a collaborative effort, but even disregarding the obvious centrality of these three people to the project the issue isn’t really about that. Kurvitz has been working on this world together with his friends since they were teenagers. It’s clearly his life’s work. Just because he was allegedly a shitty boss doesn’t mean he deserves to have the IP stolen from under him.
Kurvitz, his girlfriend, and his best friend all left together when no one else wanted to isn’t really impressing me with how great of a person he is to work for.
I don’t know what their personal relations has to do with their creative accomplishments, and it seems you are arguing a different point than I am so I’m confused. I’m not really concerned with how Kurvitz was as a boss and leader, I wasn’t there so I couldn’t possibly have anything to comment regarding the allegations (though from reading the interviews with the devs who were fired just the other day it seems the problems with the toxic work environment endured way past his exit so he can’t have been the sole cause unlike what the corporate leaders claimed).
I do agree that it was lightning in a bottle and unlikely to happen again, but the state of affairs do change more than who gets to collect residual income from DE sales over the years: Kurvitz and co. are not allowed to do further work in the world of Elysium. Sure, if the allegations were true he would maybe not be able to hold another video game development team together, but perhaps he might write another novel?
Regardless of what you think of him and his friends, they together created the world of Elysium over the course of several decades, which is what makes it so rich and deep. What makes me most sad is that they’re locked out of further exploring it, and subsequently so are we.
I was under the impression that ZA/UM owns the rights for not just the game but the world of Elysium, though I am not a copyright lawyer or anything so I don’t know what exactly is copywritable.
There were six writers, and dozens of other people, for most of the development of Disco Elysium. Why would it be any better for just three of them to get the rights?
As far as I know the world of Elysium was created and developed as a setting for a D&D game Kurvitz was DMing for his friend group starting from his teens. That group of people built it together over two decades. Kurvitz also wrote a novel set in that world, which released in 2013. The setting already existed and was pretty developed when work started on Disco Elysium the video game. If you want to get into the weeds I agree that people like Hindpere and Rostov have less of a claim on the IP than people like Martin Luiga and Argo Tuulik who were part of that campaign DMed by Kurvitz. Tuulik was the last writer who worked on DE remaining at ZA/UM, but he seems to have been fired the other day. The interview with him was a good read.
I don’t think it’s as easy as just changing some names and moving on, mainly on a personal level. The attachment to this world has to be immense after all these years. I don’t think Kurvitz and co. want to just make something set in a fantastical post-soviet setting, I think they want to work in Elysium specifically. At least that’s how I would feel, were I in their shoes.
Second, there is so much detail in the world that both gives it character a and is most likely copywritable. They have to come up with new, legally distinct versions of the innocentic system, Dolores Dei, the Coalition, the >!pale!< and the isolas etc etc. I think it’s much more likely they do something completely different than something akin to “legally distinct DE”. Though if Kurvitz just ends up bitterly doing nothing but relapse on his alcoholism then that wouldn’t surprise me either. Again, that’s probably what I would do in his shoes.
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I don’t think anybody is saying that.
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Sure, and many people forget Helen Hindpere (second lead writer) and Aleksandr Rostov (art director) also left with Kurvitz. And even then, despite Rostov being responsible for the overall visual style the Thought Cabinet was painted by Anton Vill, and I don’t know for sure who made the portraits/skill depictions but it might also have been him (though they are more in the style of Rostov - see the 3 archetype paintings which were created by Rostov).
Look, I know it was a collaborative effort, but even disregarding the obvious centrality of these three people to the project the issue isn’t really about that. Kurvitz has been working on this world together with his friends since they were teenagers. It’s clearly his life’s work. Just because he was allegedly a shitty boss doesn’t mean he deserves to have the IP stolen from under him.
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I don’t know what their personal relations has to do with their creative accomplishments, and it seems you are arguing a different point than I am so I’m confused. I’m not really concerned with how Kurvitz was as a boss and leader, I wasn’t there so I couldn’t possibly have anything to comment regarding the allegations (though from reading the interviews with the devs who were fired just the other day it seems the problems with the toxic work environment endured way past his exit so he can’t have been the sole cause unlike what the corporate leaders claimed).
I do agree that it was lightning in a bottle and unlikely to happen again, but the state of affairs do change more than who gets to collect residual income from DE sales over the years: Kurvitz and co. are not allowed to do further work in the world of Elysium. Sure, if the allegations were true he would maybe not be able to hold another video game development team together, but perhaps he might write another novel?
Regardless of what you think of him and his friends, they together created the world of Elysium over the course of several decades, which is what makes it so rich and deep. What makes me most sad is that they’re locked out of further exploring it, and subsequently so are we.
deleted by creator
I was under the impression that ZA/UM owns the rights for not just the game but the world of Elysium, though I am not a copyright lawyer or anything so I don’t know what exactly is copywritable.
As far as I know the world of Elysium was created and developed as a setting for a D&D game Kurvitz was DMing for his friend group starting from his teens. That group of people built it together over two decades. Kurvitz also wrote a novel set in that world, which released in 2013. The setting already existed and was pretty developed when work started on Disco Elysium the video game. If you want to get into the weeds I agree that people like Hindpere and Rostov have less of a claim on the IP than people like Martin Luiga and Argo Tuulik who were part of that campaign DMed by Kurvitz. Tuulik was the last writer who worked on DE remaining at ZA/UM, but he seems to have been fired the other day. The interview with him was a good read.
It’s a sorry situation for everyone involved.
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I don’t think it’s as easy as just changing some names and moving on, mainly on a personal level. The attachment to this world has to be immense after all these years. I don’t think Kurvitz and co. want to just make something set in a fantastical post-soviet setting, I think they want to work in Elysium specifically. At least that’s how I would feel, were I in their shoes.
Second, there is so much detail in the world that both gives it character a and is most likely copywritable. They have to come up with new, legally distinct versions of the innocentic system, Dolores Dei, the Coalition, the >!pale!< and the isolas etc etc. I think it’s much more likely they do something completely different than something akin to “legally distinct DE”. Though if Kurvitz just ends up bitterly doing nothing but relapse on his alcoholism then that wouldn’t surprise me either. Again, that’s probably what I would do in his shoes.
Maybe you should just watch the video, and the previous one he did on the subject?
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the previous one
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